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Eve Rodsky’s Fair Play method has swept the nation and become a cultural phenomenon. By being intentional about how we define our roles, rebalancing our to-do list, and feeling aligned with our partners, we are able to challenge societal norms to find a fair balance of the mental load of parenthood that works best for us.

Joining me this week is certified Fair Play method facilitator and LMSW, Lauren A. Tetenbaum.

This episode will help you catalog and understand your unique needs and offer you a framework for communicating them to your partner-in-parenting so that you can strengthen your bond and the feeling of equity and connection within your relationship.


Lauren (00:00):

What I really like about Fair Play as a tool is that it’s not about an equal division. It doesn’t mean, okay, well I did that. You do this, then we flip flop. Whatever it is. It just has to feel fair. Not necessarily 50/50, but fair.

Dr. Sarah (00:20):

When your child is exhibiting any type of difficult behaviors, things like hitting, biting tantrums, or even just having overwhelming emotions like a fear of the dark that’s keeping them from staying in their bed through the night. I’m always trying to help parents reframe their approach from being me versus my kid to being me and my kid versus the problem. This small but impactful shift not only realigns you to become bonded as a team, but this feeling of closeness and connection that results from this is more effective for managing whatever problem you’re facing. And we can do this exact same strategy with our partners as well.


So joining me today to talk about Eve Rodsky’s Fair Play Method and how to create an equitable division of labor inside of a household, whether it’s managing the home or the family life and doing this without feeling constantly pitted against your partner, but actually in collaboration with them is Lauren Tenenbaum. Lauren is an advocate and therapist certified in perinatal mental health and she specializes in life transitions affecting women and such a good conversation. So if you are feeling overwhelmed and overworked with domestic or caregiving tasks, this episode, reviewing strategies and techniques for rethinking how you manage a household in a way that feels right to you and your partner in an equitable way might just be the key that you need to take that first step towards rebalancing your role and reducing your feelings of burnout because I know I have them too.


Hi, I’m Dr. Sarah Bren, a clinical psychologist and mom of two. In this podcast, I’ve taken all of my clinical experience, current research on brain science and child psychology and the insights I’ve gained on my own parenting journey and distilled everything down into easy to understand and actionable parenting insights so you can tune out the noise and tune into your own authentic parenting voice with confidence and calm. This is Securely Attached.


Hi everyone. We are so lucky to have Lauren Tetenbaum here today. She’s going to talk to us all about what it’s like to be a mom, what it’s like to carry the load and also find equity in our parenting relationships. So thanks so much for coming on the podcast.

Lauren (02:56):

Thank you for having me. Hi everybody.

Dr. Sarah (02:59):

So you have a practice. We kind of float in the same therapy circles. I have been seeing the work that you’ve been doing for a while. I’m really glad that you are coming on to talk about it. How did you get interested in this type of work? How did you get into the Fair play model?

Lauren (03:19):

Yeah so like you said, we are both Westchester, New York based therapists and moms of two, and we have a lot in common, in particular the interest and passion of working with families with young kids. My focus is really on maternal mental health and I would say that half my clients are moms, whether they’re in the postpartum period or transitioning back to work or just living their lives as working moms. And the other half of my clientele are young women and in their twenties I came into this work in a non-linear fashion. Growing up I always wanted to advocate for women and I thought that the best way to do that would be to go to law school, which I did right after college, didn’t like it. So I also got my master’s in social work and I’ve been licensed as a social work since 2011. I did work in the legal industry for over a decade, but upon becoming a mom, I felt like my passion really lied with supporting other women and working parents and over a series of events throughout the pandemic, I decided to pivot, go into clinical work, focusing specifically on women and moms.

Dr. Sarah (04:35):

Amazing, amazing. And how does the Fair Play model play into all of this? And maybe explain what it is because people are like, what’s Fair Play?

Lauren (04:46):

Yes. So I know that most people can’t see, but I do have the deck of cards and the book here with me. Fair Play is a book by Eve Rodsky who’s also a former lawyer and a mom, and she wrote it in 2019 and I read it in 2020. I want to say it was the early days of the pandemic. And I felt seen and heard because she was talking about the inequities that women in our culture face as moms, even if they’re the primary breadwinner in their home, even if their partner, if they have one, had said from the outset, this will be an equitable partnership, parent, co-parent dynamic, she found through a series of interviews and a lot of research that women were bearing the load, the invisible load, the mental load, and it was exhausting them. And when I read it, I felt so validated and I wanted to shout it from the rooftops. And I pretty much do that now through my practice, my work, and I work closely with the Fair Play team at Hello Sunshine in training other mental health professionals and executive coaches in the method.

Dr. Sarah (05:56):

Amazing. So can you break down a little bit of what the sort of tenants of Fair Play are?

Lauren (06:02):

Absolutely. So Fair Play is designed for households. I’m going to use heteronormative language and say mom and dad, husband, wife, but truly this can be applied to any household dynamic in which people are sharing caregiving or domestic tasks. I have used it before with sisters, with roommates, so I do want to point that out. But for the purpose of just having this conversation kind of use mom and dad, although again it’s not only for parents is a system in which there are mutually agreed upon expectations of who’s doing what and what that means. And Eve made it into a really fun accessible game through the deck of cards in which there are 100 household tasks like laundry, doing the dishes like packing lunch, making the kids doctor’s appointments. And the idea of the system is that you sit down with your partner or your mother or your roommate, et cetera, et cetera, and you say, what does doing the dishes mean to you? What does it mean to me? You come to a mutually agreed upon expectation of what that is, and then one person is assigned to do that task from conception through planning, through execution. So they own it in full. It’s not just mom delegating, I ordered the stuff, go pick it up. It’s saying that Mom will handle this task from beginning to end, but then dad will handle whatever else you agree upon.

Dr. Sarah (07:46):

I love that and I think that, and we can really talk about this a lot, but I think that addresses the mental load piece because I think sometimes we forget that tasks are not just the execution of a task. They’re not just doing the dishes or going to the grocery store. If I am the one that goes to the grocery store, I’m also the one that is always having a running checklist in my mind of what foods in the fridge, what’s about to expire, what do we need to make sure we eat now because it’s going to go bad? What are we running low on? What do the kids need to bring on their, is it a birthday coming up when they need to bring cupcakes to school? All the things that I’m holding in my brain, my mental load that nobody else sees. A lot of times we refer to it as the invisible work. And so somebody might think, oh, I went to the grocery store for my partner. I took that off their list. But what did you perhaps to get to the gro before you got to the grocery store? You probably said, I’m going to the grocery store, what do we need? And so you’re downloading that person’s mental load and the labor that they have always been you spending and you are just taking the physical task off their hand, but you are not taking the mental load off. Yeah, this sounds like it speaks exactly to that.

Lauren (09:21):

Exactly. And like I said before, even in households where you have the best of intentions because of cultural expectations, it has been found that women still bear the brunt of this load. And so we can’t just kind of take things for granted and say, oh, well he wants to help and he is going to the grocery store. We do really need to sit down and divide up the work because it is work.

Dr. Sarah (09:50):

And I think it’s interesting, obviously there are also tasks as mowing the lawn for example, or I’m trying to think of another example that could be considered. It’s a lot of work to do, but the stress of it, the actual emotional and physical stress of it is for a lot of people perhaps maybe relaxing. I get to listen to my music and get some fresh air. I can get in the zone. I’m not being interrupted 15 times when I’m doing this. Whereas if the task is bath time, it’s loud, it’s got getting splash, you’ve got to get them, you got to wrangle the kids in, you got to convince them to get out, you got to clean up afterwards. And it’s a very high stress for a lot of families task. And so one parent is like, well, I’m owed the lawn. And the other parent’s like, well, I did the bath time, but who is spending more energy and who’s feeling more stressed at the end of that task? And so it’s not to say that there, there’s more or less value in either one, but I think sometimes we forget that there’s also more fallout and ripple effects. So the over the sort of total amount of stress that one experiences based on what tasks they’re doing. And oftentimes when you have kids, the tasks that are related to the kids are the ones that are more stressful and more over stimulating.

Lauren (11:37):

They require more emotional labor. And studies have shown that men, while they may actively participate in household duties, they do tend to do the kind of lawn mowing tasks that involve independence. It’s they a little more freedom in there. And what I really like about Fair Play as a tool is that it’s not about an equal division. It doesn’t mean, okay, well I did that, you do this, then we flip flop, whatever it is. It just has to feel fair, not necessarily 50/50, but fair. And there’s also flexibility within that too. Say, you know what? I’ve been doing that for a while, I need a break, so why don’t we reverse it or whatever you might want to do.

Dr. Sarah (12:21):

Yeah. And I think that’s interesting too because I imagine what feels fair to one partnership would look totally different in another partnership. So there’s a lot of subjectivity to it.

Lauren (12:34):

Absolutely. And that can change day to day. So Eve likes to suggest weekly check-ins. When I work with couples on this method, I also suggest weekly check-ins or every two weeks depending on their communication styles. Everything is subjective, everything is based on personal preferences, logistics, maybe someone doesn’t get home from work until later, and so they don’t have access to certain tasks during the week. So it’s malleable, but it does take into account that we all really do need to do our part to assert our needs and stick with them. So stick with our values so that it feels fair.

Dr. Sarah (13:20):

And that’s another thing that I think is worth talking about is it’s hard to know what your needs are. It’s hard. A lot of times when I talk about the invisible work when I’m working with couples, a lot of times people are like, oh my God, you’re right. I do have a lot of, I didn’t even think about the fact that I, look, we don’t as a society really teach people what invisible work is. We just kind of take it for granted. And it tends to be primarily and historically the sort of maternal responsibility for a lot of it household tasks have lived in the domain of the mother. Obviously that is changing a lot now in a great and important way. But I think that’s seeing the very, very tip of that wave. This is not revolutionized the world yet. We live in a world where there are still a lot of not just expectations that are antiquated, but our own awareness of how much we participate in these roles is limited. We’re not having these conversations that women or men are made to appreciate the invisible load, which then makes it very difficult to ask for what you need.

Lauren (14:45):

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, COVID brought about a lot of changes in the workplace and flexibility and people working from home. And increasingly there have also been more open discussions about policies like paid leave for any kind of parent, which is all wonderful, but we have a ways to go. Just recently, there was a conversation I won’t slander the person who said it, but basically the head of a very big financial institution to whom a lot of people look for guidance on the industry made a comment on how women did need the opportunity for some flexibility in that comment. He’s making the assumption that it’s the woman who’s the default, or as Eve says, the she default parent and his point I think, or should have been for parents or for anyone to have flexibility to engage in caregiving. But he, many of us do assume that it’s going to be the woman in charge of the caregiving, the domestic work. And we see that reflected in popular culture in commercials for cooking, cleaning that is changing. But we have a ways to go.

Dr. Sarah (16:08):

And I mean we see it in kids’ toys and that’s the precursor to their internalized sense of these imbalances and how many kids, boys are getting aprons and cooking sets probably a lot more nowadays, at least in, I would guess that the people listening to this podcast are pretty there are some pretty progressive parents in this audience, in this community, and I actually don’t think you need to be progressive to get your son an apron and a cooking set, but I do think they’re also becoming more educated consumers of the kind of marketing. But I do think we have to watch the way that we inadvertently indoctrinate the generation that’s to come because that’s how we got it. It came in subliminally.

Lauren (17:07):

And it’s, again, it’s everywhere. Even in the terminology. There’s a lot of young kids, sorry, classes for young kids in the neighborhood and they’re often called mommy and me. I love mom’s groups. I love when women get together, but to call them mommy and me connotes that it’s going to be mommy doing the caregiving. What if your daddy cousin, whatever it is. So I always say, I do say, because I’m a very loud and proud advocate, I suggest to the venue, how about you change it to caregiver and kid or whatever. It’s so be more inclusive.

Dr. Sarah (17:45):

And I think too, it might be worth, I know we were talking kind of as a disclaimer that we were going to talk, present this in terms of heteronormative relationships for the simplicity of the conversation, but realistically, like you, there is the same inequity in heterosexual relationships. It’s a role of the default parent and it can create a lot of tension. And it’s not necessarily because it’s the woman, because the default parent might be one of two dads. The default parent might be a dad in a heterosexual relationship, the default parent might be a mom in a homosexual relationship. So it’s very interesting to make this distinction that default parenthood is one to be a default parent. There usually is one. But I guess what, maybe there’s a distinction here to be maybe between the primary parent and the default parent. What would you distinguish those two things?

Lauren (18:51):

So a couple thoughts on that. Eve’s research found that while you’re right, when someone in a partnership kind of assumes the primary caregiver, let’s say role yes, of course that comes along with a lot of expectations that are typically what we’re talking about when we talk about the mom’s work. But she found in her research that among homosexual couples, there was better communication around what was expected from each person regarding each task. And so that’s what it boils down to, right? Communicating your expectations. And that’s something that we want to see and all relationship dynamics.


When it comes to default parent, primary parent given my legal background, I personally am sensitive to the term primary parent, primary caregiver because we see that a lot in parental leave policies. And it always troubled me because if you’re giving the primary caregiver more time of paid leave, that person automatically becomes the primary caregiver. And in our culture, that’s typically the birth mother. And so from literally the day that the baby arrives, mom is considered the primary caregiver. She’s the one who’s going to know the baby’s routines better, et cetera, and dad has to go back to work very soon. And from the beginning, mom is the default. Now, practically, sometimes there needs to be a primary, for example, on the school form, there has to be who’s the first call? Who’s the second call? Arguably, as Ruth Bader Ginsburg said, you can alternate calls or not. You can say, please call mom or please call dad whatever you want. But the whole point about fair play is that we shouldn’t make assumptions on who that person will be. And in my opinion, primary, secondary, I don’t love that term, but I guess I would say I’m okay with using it in very specific context. I don’t think there should always be one primary unless that’s what they decided.

Dr. Sarah (21:01):

And I think it’s the choice. And that for me, when I’m thinking of a distinction between default and primary, maybe it’s semantics, but I’m thinking default means we didn’t even plan it, it just happened. It’s a very, oops, there we go. We did it again. Whereas primary to me, the way I’m using it in my head is these are the roles that we chose based on our particular family dynamic. So not because I’m defaulted to, but because in our balance of the share of the work, I have the time to do this, and this is my role, and it might shift, I was the primary parent, primary caregiver of my children when they were infants. And throughout probably the first two years of their life, each of them, because I was breastfeeding, I was doing a lot of things and I had, it shifted my work to allow me to do that once my kids got older. And my working situation changed in part due to covid and in part due to choices that me and my husband made together as a family, I became the secondary caregiver. And he is functionally the primary caretaker from a planned from how we divide the childcare labor.


This is not the same thing as a primary attachment figure. And we could talk about that. Not to say that my children are not deeply attached to their dad. They are, but somehow they’re, and actually as they get older, I think it also shifts. But when your children are a little, typically the primary attachment figure is the mom, not because they’re more important or that relationship is more important, but typically because of the physical aspect of how a mother cares for their child and in heterosexual relationships that don’t have a mother or maybe that have two mothers. It’s really the person who’s doing a lot of the physical caregiving of the infant that’s going to create that attachment figure. That’s that primary attachment figure. But it’s interesting, my family chose to do this choice and it shifted. So I think, but default is different to me because it’s like I still carry some of the mental load of the stuff by default because sometimes we forget to think about it.

Lauren (23:48):

Right. No, I think you’re absolutely right. It comes down to choice and again, to communication. I have one client who uses terminology she came up with on her own, which is, well, I’m taking the lead on the weekend activities and my husband’s taking the lead. She says, take the lead, which I really like. I love that. And again, that allows for movement for shifting.

Dr. Sarah (24:12):

And I think that’s also this idea of those are tasks. We take the lead on tasks, we don’t take the lead on roles and maybe we need to get out of thinking about roles and more into thinking about this sort of task. And I think that’s what Fair Play kind of strives to do. Yeah, the more we sort of reorient ourselves to the tasks, we can reconfigure the roles. And it’s sort of like that’s the byproduct.

Lauren (24:35):

And it’s fun, truly because it also allows people to start small when we’re working with people who are overwhelmed to say, we’re going to shift your entire family dynamic and these roles in society. I mean, that can add to the overwhelm, but if we start with literally who’s in charge of lunch this week and what does that mean and who’s going to be handling it from conception through planning, through execution, easier to digest and it’s a starting point and most things that involve behavioral change, I think starting small is a good idea.

Dr. Sarah (25:16):

That makes so much sense. I’m thinking too, how do people end up working with you and how does Fair Play get introduced? Is it usually a couple has just come to complete loggerheads and they’re like, I can’t deal with this anymore, Lauren, help us figure this out? Or is it typically one person dragging the other in? How do you navigate getting both people interested in looking at this?

Lauren (25:43):

Yes. So getting both people interested is a good question and I’ll come back to that in general. There is a group of certified Fair Play facilitators and everyone is listed on the Fair Play Life website, and I also recommend that all of your listeners watch the Fair Play documentary, which is available on most streaming services. It’s a really great film. It was produced by Hello Sunshine. And because of the film, because of Eve’s work, because of all of these facilitators doing various works all over the world, really people come to any of us. Some of us are therapists, some of us are executive coaches, et cetera, and they ask for help with these issues. For me personally, because my practice is women focused, I see a lot of women on their own who then bring the tools back to their household. And I also see some couples.


So that’s how people find me in general when there’s some discrepancy in terms of who wants to implement the system and who doesn’t. There’s like all couples counseling, there might be some resistance in general by one or both parties in. Ultimately the couple has to have the shared value of wanting the other person in their relationship, two, not feel resentment, anger, frustration, et cetera. And maybe my husband, for example doesn’t understand why I needed the laundry done every Sunday night to start the week I’m making this up. Although I do talk about him a lot as an example. So maybe he doesn’t prioritize it the same way I do, but if I explain, well, this is important to me, he has to be willing to hear that and to meet me there for the sake of my happiness. That’s not a general statement because I can’t always have it my way. That wouldn’t be compromising. But in a healthy relationship, even if you’re fighting and getting very frustrated with each other, if you both show up to the table of, well, I want to make this better, I want you to not feel ass frustrated, I want to contribute. If you have that overall goal, then there’s room to bring in the system. And frankly, if you’re getting met with resistance, that cannot be overcome. I think that you have to look deep within yourself and question, do we share the same values?

Dr. Sarah (28:29):

Yeah, and I think it’s interesting because I, we’ve been talking a lot in some of the examples we’ve been using, and they’re examples because this really tends to be the pattern is that the typically dad jobs and tasks get done in a certain way, and then the typically mom tasks, which can be more labor intensive and emotionally taxing. So then when we are talking about equity, we’re often saying the dads have to stop doing the lawn mowing and all of the fun, relaxing, fun, maybe not fun, but I get some solo time kind of tasks and need to start helping understand the mom’s mental load better and supporting these burnt out moms, which is probably, in many cases, a hundred percent the truth. That’s the way it is. But I also think a lot of dads can feel super alienated by these narratives, dads who are really genuinely showing up and doing tasks and mowing the lawn, which is really helpful.


And I’m so mindful of not wanting families to lack the skills to say, I’m going to be able to look at this from your perspective, and how do I take into account your needs and your perceptions of my needs? You are trying to help, and I’m getting frustrated nonetheless. So how do I ask for my partner to come meet me in the middle or come to the table and have a conversation about equity in our work when my partner genuinely feels like they are helping and can perhaps feel like that effort is dismissed by saying we need to renegotiate all the tasks.

Lauren (30:36):

Most couples work using I statements can be incredibly powerful, not accusing the other, and also reminding yourself that probably your partner isn’t trying to not listen or trying to make things harder for you. This is all very based in how we are all socialized. And so I do want to make clear that we’re not here blaming men, yelling at men in our culture. These are the patterns that we see. But I very much agree that a lot of men that I know personally and professionally are showing up and do want to be equitable in their homes. I recently, I’ve been working with a couple where they are thinking about having kids soon, and they specifically came to me before they were pregnant to implement fair play because while the man felt like he did his part and also this big notion of, well, I do half the work, it goes back to that half the woman felt that she was carrying way too much of the load, and she worried about how that would be exacerbated once they did have kids.


And he is the kind of partner, like I said earlier, who is saying, well, I think I do up, but I hear you. I hear that you’re frustrated and that you’re feeling overwhelmed and I love you and care about you and do want an equitable household. So it’s not tell me what I’m doing wrong and how to fix it. How can we collaborate so that we both feel satisfied, fulfilled, respected, appreciated. And again, that might change the following week if they have a big work assignment or whatever it is. It allows for that flexibility. But a tool, Fairplay really opens up the opportunity for being on the same team instead of fighting each other.

Dr. Sarah (32:41):

I like that. I think this idea, and even in parenting, it’s like it’s on the same team. We have the same goals, but perhaps how we’ve envisioned executing those goals might differ. And so how do we connect with our partnership here? I connect with our identity as partners and say, this is for us. This is for us to have health in our relationship to not build resentment from for either person. And I think that’s a big way to get people to the table, is to say, Hey, you do stuff, a lot of stuff. I need to understand all the things that you do to support this family because you’re doing so many of them. So that I can show gratitude and so I can understand how much work you put in, and I want you to know the things that I do and understand all the invisible parts of them so that you can show me gratitude so that neither one of us builds resentment because we know resentment is a really toxic thing for relationships. It’s so insidious and it really just kind of festers and grows. And if it grows too big, it can really, really damage trust in safety and relationships. And so it’s like this is prophylactic, this is an inoculation, this is your, what do we call? This is your vaccine. Yeah. And resentment.

Lauren (34:07):

I like that instead. I mean it is reparative depending on the context, but it’s proactive. It’s not reactive, which I think is really important. And I think that people needs to be open-minded. I’ll give you a quick example of how we recently redistributed a card. My daughter was getting lunch at school and then decided she’s four, so she decided she no longer liked the lunch, even though she eats the same food every day at home. And the school asked me, because they see me more often you need to make her lunch. I really didn’t want to do that. And I felt frustrated with society, not my husband, but the way that it was set up that it assumed that I would be the one making the lunch. I just really don’t making lunch. So my husband said, well, I’ll do it. And he loves making her lunches and writes her cute drawings and he is it, it’s great. And that wasn’t a task that he was necessarily avoiding, but it was assumed for a variety of reasons that I would do it. I articulated my needs and said, I don’t want to do it. And he totally stepped up and I don’t think twice about it and it’s good.

Dr. Sarah (35:22):

Yeah, that actually that interesting piece of not thinking twice the sort of implication that if we allow for someone to take over our jobs, that we feel guilty, that we feel, and I think that’s also if the teachers are asking the mom to pack the lunch and the mom asked the dad to pack the lunch, are we in some way passing off the job and therefore should feel as though we’ve just, we just abdicated our responsibility. We shirked something, we should feel bad about that and mm-hmm. Curious what your take on that is. Cause I think that’s such a common experience for moms.

Lauren (36:03):

Totally. And it pops up all the time. Even chatting with another parent after drop off, what did you make for lunch today? I’m like, I didn’t make the lunch. And then should I feel bad? I have no idea what’s in the lunchbox. I just put it in her backpack. Most mom guilt related things. I am a big fan of self-compassion, which I know you are too. Would you tell your friend you’re a terrible mom that you don’t know what’s in her lunchbox? No, you wouldn’t. Right? And so treat yourself the way you would a friend. I also think that maternal gatekeeping rears its head all the time with these issues, understandably. And I’m guilty of it too. And again, that’s why I like fair Ply because it’s flexible. It allows for regaling the deck. You can change your mind, you can mess up unquote, and then fix it. My husband said he was going to handle birthday gifts for classmates’, birthdays for our kids. And then I said to him, well, okay, but tell me exactly what you’re getting and when you’re getting it and I need to know all the details. And he said, Lauren, no, I got it. I’m doing it. I said, you’re right. My bad. And what a relief I, I’m done. So we all have to practice feeling more comfortable with letting go and taking ownership on the flip side.

Dr. Sarah (37:25):

I love that. And can you customize this deck? What if there’s tasks that are super unique to your family?

Lauren (37:32):

Absolutely. So one of the best parts is that you start typically by crossing out or removing from the deck, the cards that don’t apply. So if you don’t have kids, that’s a big chunk. If you do have kids, but you know, don’t live in a house or whatever, there are things you can easily take out. And then of course, there are things that are specific to your family that you might want to add in or add in details. So it’s really just a starting point.

Dr. Sarah (38:00):

I love that. And so people want to learn more about your work, if they want to get in touch with you, if they want to learn more about Fair Play, where can we direct them?

Lauren (38:12):

Sure. So my website is latcounseling.com, and I am on Instagram as @thecounselaur, and all of the Fair Play info, including a new campaign that I think you’ll like, which is teaching kids in partnership with Proctor and Gamble products Fair Play and Hello Sunshine are teaching Kids about Home Equity. So it’s this new campaign launched this past week, and I’ll send you the info because I know you’ll be a big fan. It’s homeeq.io all of that stuff, the documentary, the book, et cetera. It’s at fairplaylife.com.

Dr. Sarah (38:51):

That’s so great because I think that this is, it’s interesting, we’re talking so much about parents and couples, and I always say that whatever, whenever you can apply a rule to a parent relationship, there is a definite parallel to a parent-child relationship. And while I’m not, I wasn’t assuming that there was going to be a deck for parents and kids to do, I think that this is a big thing that we, I mean, I’m always thinking about in my family is like, how do I help my children feel like they have ownership and responsibility? And how do I foster a sense of just genuine motivation to do some things because I’m I’m ambivalent about sticker charts and chore charts. I don’t actually want to make my, I mean, kids are five and three. I don’t want to make them do chores and then have it build this sense of…

Lauren (39:43):


Dr. Sarah (39:44):

Resentment, and also not just resentment, but a extrinsic motivation. If I want my kids to help me with the dishes, I’m going to do the dishes with my kids and have it be a source of connection, building and fun and help them teach that skill. And then I totally move myself out of that equation and not just say, you have to do this because I said you have to do this and that’s your job. But I also feel like I want want to help my kids understand why we do these things. We’re all part of this family, we’re all part of this community, we’re on the same team. We got to help keep this house put together. We all live here.

Lauren (40:25):

It’s got to get done. And then again, that’s why Fair Play is so great, because it is about the legacy that you’re leaving for your kids, the behaviors that you’re modeling for them. And if you implement gender equity in your relationship in your household, it will have far-reaching implications in the workplace, in society for the next generation. So that’s why I love it.

Dr. Sarah (40:48):

Yeah, makes it like a double, double whammy. It’s extra, extra useful. Well, thank you so much for coming on the show. It’s great talking with you.

Lauren (40:56):

Thank you for having me.

Dr. Sarah (41:04):

Thanks so much for listening to this week’s podcast. This episode was all about being intentional in the way that you divide up the responsibilities in your home. When applying this intentionality to your life, whether in your partnership or the decisions you make when raising your children, you are going to start to notice a massive impact rather than just doing something because it’s the way you’ve always done it. Pause for a moment, reflect on whether what you’re doing is getting you closer to achieving your goal or not.

(41:36):If you want support in helping you clear the clutter and focus on what really matters, go to drsarahbren.com/secure and check out my free guide that will help you understand the four pillars that are most important to focus on when fostering a secure attachment bond. This is going to help you to know what really matters and what is just noise that you can try to tune out to download this free guide, just go to drsarahbren.com/secure. Until next week, don’t be a stranger.

I want to hear from you! Send me a topic you want me to cover or a question you want answered on the show!

DM me on Instagram at @securelyattachedpodcast or @drsarahbren

Send an email to info@drsarahbren.com

And check out drsarahbren.com for more parenting resources 

96. Balancing the load of parenthood: Becoming a team with your partner-in-parenting with Lauren A. Tetenbaum