Dr. Sarah (00:02):

Ever wonder what psychologists moms talk about when we get together, whether we’re consulting one another about a challenging case or one of our own kids, or just leaning on each other when parenting feels hard, because trust me, even when we do this for a living, it’s still hard. Joining me each week in these special Thursday shows are two of my closest friends, both moms, both psychologists, they’re the people I call when I need a sounding board. These are our unfiltered answers to your parenting questions. We’re letting you in on the conversations the three of us usually have behind closed doors. This is Securely Attached: Beyond the Sessions..

(00:41):

Hello. Welcome to Beyond the Sessions segment of the Securely Attached podcast, Dr. Rebecca Hershberg. Welcome back.

Dr. Rebecca (00:50):

Hi. Thank you. Love it here.

Dr. Sarah (00:54):

Okay, so I have a question from a parent who is thinking about summer camp. So she says, I’m trying to decide whether to send my 8-year-old to summer camp this year while I recognize the potential for him to have a wonderful…

Dr. Rebecca (01:07):

Is this sleep away?

Dr. Sarah (01:08):

Yep. Sleep-away.

Dr. Rebecca (01:10):

Sleep away summer camp. Okay.

Dr. Sarah (01:11):

Yes. So I’ll insert that. I’m trying to decide whether to send my 8-year-old to sleepaway summer camp this year while I recognize the potential for him to have a wonderful experience and learn valuable life skills. I can’t shake this nagging uncertainty about whether he’s truly ready for it, but it’s hard to know since I have to make a decision so many months in advance, how can I gauge my child’s readiness for sleepaway camp? I want to make sure I’m making the best decision for him.

Dr. Rebecca (01:38):

Oh my gosh, I love that question. I went through that with my now 10-year-old and just went through it with my 8-year-old. I mean, I’ll give away the punchline. My 10-year-old, we did send to sleep away camp, not when he was eight, but when he was nine and it was successful. We knew he was ready. My 8-year-old when we went to visit my older son at sleepaway camp this past summer said that he really, really wanted to go next summer, and we bandied it around for a little bit and ultimately decided not to. So that’s the, I will share the rationale, but in case the listener is like, but what’d you do? But what’d you do?

(02:19):

I think the bottom line to this question, unfortunately, but let’s just put it out. There is no way to know, right? There just isn’t. You are attempting to read the future, which is never possible. I think a really practical piece to keep in mind, which we kept in mind is how long is the deposit refundable? The spots do fill up, and so if you are really on the fence, a lot of camps are full deposit refundable until January, and that gets you a little bit closer to the summer to have a little bit better of an idea. So I know that’s a very concrete pointer, but I think it’s important. There’s other camps that, and ours is one of those where you can pay a couple extra a hundred bucks and have it be fully refundable until May. You don’t get those a hundred bucks back.

(03:05):

But to me that is a really nice insurance policy. So again, I know this isn’t camp advice, but I think those for this very specific question, those are good pointers. I think otherwise you’re looking at your kid’s emotional maturity compared to his peers. You’re looking at how separation has been for your kid. We’re looking at how your kid falling asleep at night goes, and I tend to think on this one, I mean, of course the words that when you were reading the question, Sarah that caught my attention was this, I can’t help but notice this nagging uncertainty. To me, that’s sort of your gut check, and your gut check it sounds like, is telling you, my kid’s not ready, which is, I’m not answering the question for you listener. If you decided between the time you sent it and now your kid is ready, that’s great.

(03:56):

But if you as a parent feel like there’s something holding you back, as always, we want to look at our own stuff. Did we go to some, might there be something getting in the way? But we also may have a gut sense of our kid, and I would say, at least on this question, there is in my opinion, less cost to waiting a year than there is to sending a year or too early. It’s like that false negative first false positive thing. I would rather have my kid do another year of something wonderful at home and be solidly of the opinion that they’re ready then to risk it and potentially risk a really, really rough summer that there was no need for.

Dr. Sarah (04:40):

And risk potentially them being turned off to summer camp. That having a little bit more buffer allows them to be accessing the parts of them that might really love it, that aren’t necessarily drowned out by the parts of them that are overwhelmed by it.

Dr. Rebecca (05:00):

Exactly.

Dr. Sarah (05:01):

Yeah. I think it’s just, yes, I think if you’re on the fence, err on the side of weight than go, because the risks of staying, even though they were ready to go, is not nearly as potentially impactful as the risk of going before they’re ready.

Dr. Rebecca (05:24):

And I think the fact that this listener put in that this child is eight helps point me in that direction. There’s a scenario in which the same question the kid is 11, and I would say then I would just highlight the part that I said before, which is just really look at yourself, really look at, are you a parent who’s anxious about separation? Are you someone who, because again, I think sleepaway camp may not be for every kid, and it’s really important to look at your kid, but also if you’re getting it to the point where most kids if they are going to be ready are at a developmental level where they are ready, is there something holding you back because of something going on with you? And I think that’s just general feedback that we give in these episodes.

Dr. Sarah (06:13):

Yeah, and I think too, eight is this sort of bumper year. If you think about a bell curve, right? More and more 12 year olds are going to be in that middle of the bell curve and fewer of red camp readiness and fewer will be on the tail ends at eight. That bell curve is pretty flat. A lot of eight year olds are not ready, and some many are, but not all. So I think knowing your kids’ age, but not just their age, but their sort of developmental age, not just their chronological age, if you will, can have an 8-year-old who feels really young and you can have an 8-year-old who feels really old for their age in terms of the kinds of things you’d want to be checking on, different types of skills and different types of developmental, what is the word I’m looking for?

(07:14):

Developmental kind of parts of them. Not all of our developmental fields to hit the same point at the same time. So looking at that, this mom specifically says, how can I gauge my child’s readiness for sleepaway camp? Certain developmental milestones or skills that would be helpful at a sleepaway camp to my mind are, and you’ve talked about some of them, Rebecca, is ability to fall asleep on your own ability to handle separations with minimal distress and an ability to kind of regroup afterwards. Most kids are going to have a hard time saying goodbye at the bus stop when they go off to camp, and by the time they get through the mini hour drive to camp, are they still sitting in that seat crying or have they kind of moved into the movements of the bus? Have they found someone to talk to? Have they found a way to suit themselves and kind of regroup? Those are things to think about. What are some other, in your mind, just developmental tasks that a kid wants to be masterful with in terms of what they’re in need?

Dr. Rebecca (08:31):

I think social skills, masterful might be a stretch, but if your child has a hard, and I think, sorry, I’m going to cut myself off. So much also comes down to what are you looking for in a camp, right? There are certain camps that will really help a kid with that stuff. There’s other camps that it’s a little bit more of a Lord of the Flies kind of feel. But I think social skills are a big one. Again, I think falling asleep by themselves, there’s plenty of eight year olds who still really need or want either a parent or a set of three songs. Always. Is this a kid who’s really tied to rituals that happen at home and you’re not sure how they would do without those rituals, in which case you could practice a little bit and see. I’m just trying to think of other realms. If it’s a camp, depending on what the activities are at camp, I would want my child to be at least fairly proficient in at least one of them so that their self-esteem and self-confidence didn’t take too big a hit.

Dr. Sarah (09:37):

Flexibility feels like a really big one. Like flexibility and adaptability. When things don’t go the way you expect or when things don’t go the way that you want them to, does that derail you for a long time? Are you able to kind of, at the very least, regroup and get back to enjoying and playing, or do you usually need someone to pass that hump.

Dr. Rebecca (10:01):

Sorry to interrupt. I’m having, speaking of impulse control, I’m having a hard time today, but I also think, it sounds like perhaps this parent would have an easier time knowing what all those things were if she had to decide in May and camp starts in June. I think part of the issue is that, which she outlines very well in her question is that you’re supposed to make this decision in October and between October and June is like a significant percentage of this child’s life, and so some of those skills are going to really, really develop. Again, that’s where we get into the, if you’re going to hedge your bets and we’re really talking about an 8-year-old, there’s really no harm in waiting and there’s potential harm both for that year and future years in sort of forging ahead despite feeling uncertain. I do think in this particular question as it is phrased, I stand pretty firmly on weight, which is just so exciting. I want to highlight that I actually have an answer, and it’s a simple one. It’s like one freaking word, wait. It’s clear. I feel like this is a celebratory episode of Beyond the Sessions where I can answer the question, even answer the question that was asked.

Dr. Sarah (11:14):

I know this is going to be the shortest episode in the history of beyond the Sessions. I agree and I really do. We went in doubt. Wait, I also think one thing we didn’t say that I think is important is how long is the camp? Because some camps are two weeks at eight and some are five and some are eight weeks. So that’s also another consideration is like if you to totally undo what we were just saying about having a clear answer and not equivocating how long the session is is also important. But yeah, when in doubt, wait.

Dr. Rebecca (11:54):

When in doubt, wait. Boom.

Dr. Sarah (11:55):

Boom. Alright. Thank you for writing this in. Thank you, Dr. Hershberg. We will see you soon.

Dr. Rebecca (12:00):

Pleasure, as always. Bye

Dr. Sarah (12:02):

Bye.

(12:02):Thank you so much for listening. As you can hear, parenting is not one size fits all. It’s nuanced and it’s complicated. So I really hope that this series where we’re answering your questions really helps you to cut through some of the noise and find out what works best for you and your unique child. If you have a burning parenting question, something you’re struggling to navigate or a topic you really want us to shed light on or share research about, we want to know, go to drsarahbren.com/question to send in anything that you want, Rebecca, Emily, and me to answer in Securely Attached: Beyond the Sessions. That’s drsarahbren.com/question. And check back for a brand new securely attached next Tuesday. And until then, don’t be a stranger.